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Old 01-07-2011, 11:03   #301
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Who said we don't question it? The prophet didn't state more than +20,000 hadith (sayings) for kicks. He was being questioned, qur'an wasn't all clear because people were new to it.

Just because I don't go around asking "who created god" or saying human were monkies, doesn't mean I don't have my own unclear questions

Islam promotes philosophy, if there was anything muslims should be thanked for, it would be their philosophy and literature.

We just have.....boundaries, we don't want to spend our entire life wondering what happened million years ago.

Any revelation whatsoever should not be modified anytime the humans want to fit their needs.

Hell, saying there are new testament and old testament is just bull, how is that supposed to be a revelation handed from god if 90 pct of it was adjusted by a human?

Unless by "old testament" you mean Judaism?

Qur'an however was not touched and yet it contains no error whatsoever, you say it needs to be modernized, lol It mentioned miracles/chain of accidents that would happen in the future (our past/present) and all of them already happened, let alone the ones that will happen sooner or later.

Why do you always insist on saying that our Imams do not degenerate these horrible actions made by angry d1cks?

Islam:
1. do not kill innocents, you kill 1 soul and you'll be punished as if you killed the human race.
2. do not misuse allah's name to oppress
3. do not lie
4. do not suicide
etc...

How could this possibly lead anyone to blow themselves up in the name of allah? let alone Imams encouraging them to do this?

Bah, militants hate themselves. I just don't think they're doing it for the "religion" when it never asked them to do so


Have you even figured out why I'm here? to let you QUESTION my religion while I defend it.

But then again, define "question", I don't know what you exactly want us to question otherthan what we have already questioned our Imams about.
Those people ARE blowing themselves up, yelling and shouting "God is great" in Arabic, as they are Muslims. That's the fundamental issue at hand here, and I see no high-level Clerics, or Imams openly denouncing what they are doing. Yes, I agree, the militants obviously hate themselves, and everyone else too. Only reason why they would openly murder other Muslims too.

It's like a taboo with Islam, to denounce it when someone else screams jihad. Why? I mean, you state that the Quran says that to kill one innocent is like murdering the entire planet. So, it's a well-documented fact that these terrorists are killing innocent people. Where is the uprising against them?

I think too many people are so focused on the US, claiming we're invading Muslim land, etc. You said so yourself, a country has the right to defend itself. So...we are defending ourselves from militant Islam. Just we have better weapons, bigger guns, and the resources to wipe out entire countries.

Do you think, honestly think, that Americans want to kill innocent people, Muslim or not? How do you think a soldier feels when a bullet goes stray, and hits a civilian? It's not a party over there for these men and women, I've heard bits and pieces from my own brother who was there.

Isn't it also written in the Quran, that the eagle will bring peace of the lands of Islam, or something along those lines? Our national emblem is the Bald Eagle. Hm. Did Mohammad know something that Muslims today refuse to acknowledge?
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Old 01-07-2011, 13:53   #302
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Do you guys know why Muslims hate the US so much? Just google, "why do muslims hate the United States" You will find some articles that clarify it a bit.

You are right, the US is stronger than all of these countries Neko. Therefore, they have to resort to terrorism. In a sense it's an equilizer of power. They cannot fight us straight on.

I'm not saying I agree with killing innocent people, but just trying to put things in perspective.

Ahmed probably said this somewhere in his city of text.
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Old 01-07-2011, 14:03   #303
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Also.... why so much hate for Muslims. I've had some Muslim residents that were hard working and very respectful people.

Religions have been used as a tool to manipulate people to do dumb **** since existence All of you screaming all this hateful crap are very smart and know damn well it's not what the Quran was meant for.

I'm sure there are passages in the bible that translate to very similar meanings that you guys are attacking the Quran on. Don't expect me to quote them because I've never read more than two paragraphs in it.

A lot of Americans are just too blindly patriotic to admit these things, and Arronax just hates everything.
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Old 01-07-2011, 16:26   #304
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Ahmed probably said this somewhere in his city of text.
Lmfao xD.

Should be able to answer you neko tomorrow or something, I'm brainfuckingdead atm. =_=
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Old 01-07-2011, 16:57   #305
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It's based on faith, and if I chose to have faith, then I gotta believe that the existence of god is a fact. What I was doing with this ignorant **** arronax was proving that the religion contains no error/harm, that's all.

Meh, I can go on about miracles of the prophet and stuff. Or maybe what qur'an mentioned to happen in the future (mohammeds future is obviously our present/past.)

But then again, you all will go like "alalallala i can't hear you"



Yup, you're calling me the same, because I choose to have faith, so look at yourself, all you ever heard about Islam were stories or hearsay, and you blindly believe them. Minldless much?

Hm blind!!
You can't say that something is based on faith, then say it's a fact. If you have faith in god, that's it. Faith is there for people that choose to believe in something that doesn't have a physical existence. If god existing were fact, there would be no need for faith.

You seriously fail @ logic when it comes to faith vs fact.

Also, religion does contain harm and error. There are many verses that explicitly talk about harm being caused to someone if they do or don't do something correctly. Obviously there is error in religion, like everything else, because there are so many different kinds, most of which were the same, at some point in time. If there were no error, people wouldn't be doing wrong by their religion, which is obviously still happening in alarming numbers, in all religions.
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Old 01-07-2011, 23:26   #306
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Do you guys know why Muslims hate the US so much? Just google, "why do muslims hate the United States" You will find some articles that clarify it a bit.

You are right, the US is stronger than all of these countries Neko. Therefore, they have to resort to terrorism. In a sense it's an equilizer of power. They cannot fight us straight on.

I'm not saying I agree with killing innocent people, but just trying to put things in perspective.

Ahmed probably said this somewhere in his city of text.
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Also.... why so much hate for Muslims. I've had some Muslim residents that were hard working and very respectful people.

Religions have been used as a tool to manipulate people to do dumb **** since existence All of you screaming all this hateful crap are very smart and know damn well it's not what the Quran was meant for.

I'm sure there are passages in the bible that translate to very similar meanings that you guys are attacking the Quran on. Don't expect me to quote them because I've never read more than two paragraphs in it.

A lot of Americans are just too blindly patriotic to admit these things, and Arronax just hates everything.

Yeah, I agree that those people know it's impossible to win a conventional war against the USA. It's not so much the issue of waging war, it's the method. It goes against every human principal known. At least the good ones. Would you shoot a child in the head? Probably not, and so on and so forth.

I don't blindly hate for the sake of hating. Yes, I poke fun at Egyptians, but in my defense, most of them deserve it. However, when this whole subject started rotating around the theological things, it became interesting to me. Not because I want to shoot down Islam or Muslims, but because I want to see their reactions to the general consensus of many people.

I will also agree fully about the blind patriotism. Sometimes I think it's easier for those in control to keep people filled with something stupid, to avoid them thinking for themselves. This applies to every nation on earth, every religion, etc. I make up my mind about people based on their character. Their religion, skin color, lineage, whatever is meaningless to me. All in all, I'm in this for the thrill of the debate >_>
And to possibly learn something.
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Old 01-08-2011, 00:30   #307
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Also.... why so much hate for Muslims. I've had some Muslim residents that were hard working and very respectful people.

Religions have been used as a tool to manipulate people to do dumb **** since existence All of you screaming all this hateful crap are very smart and know damn well it's not what the Quran was meant for.

I'm sure there are passages in the bible that translate to very similar meanings that you guys are attacking the Quran on. Don't expect me to quote them because I've never read more than two paragraphs in it.

A lot of Americans are just too blindly patriotic to admit these things, and Arronax just hates everything.

Well, if you consider religion in general, stupidity, Justin Bieber, pop music and gangster rap "everything", then yes, I hate everything.
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Old 01-08-2011, 03:30   #308
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Yeah, I agree that those people know it's impossible to win a conventional war against the USA. It's not so much the issue of waging war, it's the method. It goes against every human principal known. At least the good ones. Would you shoot a child in the head? Probably not, and so on and so forth.

I don't blindly hate for the sake of hating. Yes, I poke fun at Egyptians, but in my defense, most of them deserve it. However, when this whole subject started rotating around the theological things, it became interesting to me. Not because I want to shoot down Islam or Muslims, but because I want to see their reactions to the general consensus of many people.

I will also agree fully about the blind patriotism. Sometimes I think it's easier for those in control to keep people filled with something stupid, to avoid them thinking for themselves. This applies to every nation on earth, every religion, etc. I make up my mind about people based on their character. Their religion, skin color, lineage, whatever is meaningless to me. All in all, I'm in this for the thrill of the debate >_>
And to possibly learn something.
Yea it would be cool to learn a little bit about Ahmed's take on things, but I do not feel like reading THAT much.

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Well, if you consider religion in general, stupidity, Justin Bieber, pop music and gangster rap "everything", then yes, I hate everything.
It was a joke. However, there is no need to hate Justin Bieber.
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Old 01-08-2011, 04:14   #309
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Yea it would be cool to learn a little bit about Ahmed's take on things, but I do not feel like reading THAT much.



It was a joke. However, there is no need to hate Justin Bieber.

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Old 01-08-2011, 05:18   #310
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Those people ARE blowing themselves up, yelling and shouting "God is great" in Arabic, as they are Muslims. That's the fundamental issue at hand here, and I see no high-level Clerics, or Imams openly denouncing what they are doing. Yes, I agree, the militants obviously hate themselves, and everyone else too. Only reason why they would openly murder other Muslims too.

It's like a taboo with Islam, to denounce it when someone else screams jihad. Why? I mean, you state that the Quran says that to kill one innocent is like murdering the entire planet. So, it's a well-documented fact that these terrorists are killing innocent people. Where is the uprising against them?

I think too many people are so focused on the US, claiming we're invading Muslim land, etc. You said so yourself, a country has the right to defend itself. So...we are defending ourselves from militant Islam. Just we have better weapons, bigger guns, and the resources to wipe out entire countries.

Do you think, honestly think, that Americans want to kill innocent people, Muslim or not? How do you think a soldier feels when a bullet goes stray, and hits a civilian? It's not a party over there for these men and women, I've heard bits and pieces from my own brother who was there.

Isn't it also written in the Quran, that the eagle will bring peace of the lands of Islam, or something along those lines? Our national emblem is the Bald Eagle. Hm. Did Mohammad know something that Muslims today refuse to acknowledge?
We have em Imams spam the media over here everytime something happens in Egypt, the hell you talking about.. -.-

Supporting terrorism is forbidden, not fighting it is even worse, if Imams don't do something about it, they don't deserve to be called "Imams"

http://facts-not-fear.blogspot.com/2...terrorism.html - Please, browse this page, and let's shut the whole "muslims do not oppose the terrorism" argument.

Us has screwed up more than anyone did, they butt-in whatever crap happens around the world, they make it worse instead of fixing it. Terrorists have nor will ever kill as much as the US did in the past 20-30 years.

Terrorist militants haven't made it to the US yet, I don't kno wth you're talking about, defending yourselves? seriously? who would be stupid enough to do it anyway lol. Not that it won't happen in the future considering the US has been going down the drain lately. =/

I think most American soldiers enjoy what they do, from killing innocents to rape their mothers/sisters, think we all know what I'm talking about.

A while ago, seen news and was shocked, some Israeli soldiers were breaching houses in palastine, they came to this one house and put a claymore or something to blow up when someone walks over it, so this woman opens the door and blows up infront of her kids, soliders kept laughing while childs were screaming. Guess who's still supporting them? the US is.


Supporting the actions pretty much equals committing them.


Refer to the verse and chapter number where it says "eagle will bring peace" I do not think qur'an ever mentioned "eagle" But I can't fully remember, so may you refer me to where you've seen the verse?


I'm sure mohammed knew buttloads of things that we don't, Such as being attacked by the entire world, like we are now. ;p it's a sign actually, a sign to the judgment day, or what you guys call "apocalypse".


I'm not exactly trying to drown myself into politics crap, I'm here to clear things out regarding my religion..you guys got anymore questions or?

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Old 01-08-2011, 05:20   #311
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Well, if you consider religion in general, stupidity, Justin Bieber, pop music and gangster rap "everything", then yes, I hate everything.
Didn't know you hate yourself.
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Yea it would be cool to learn a little bit about Ahmed's take on things, but I do not feel like reading THAT much.
o you mean the 2 giant posts I wrote to arronax and he couldn't understand a word of them? it was regarding the qur'an so I didn't feel like loosen up.

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You can't say that something is based on faith, then say it's a fact. If you have faith in god, that's it. Faith is there for people that choose to believe in something that doesn't have a physical existence. If god existing were fact, there would be no need for faith.

You seriously fail @ logic when it comes to faith vs fact.

Also, religion does contain harm and error. There are many verses that explicitly talk about harm being caused to someone if they do or don't do something correctly. Obviously there is error in religion, like everything else, because there are so many different kinds, most of which were the same, at some point in time. If there were no error, people wouldn't be doing wrong by their religion, which is obviously still happening in alarming numbers, in all religions.
pfft! again, I ws disproving several things he claimed to have happened in the past by using my own sources of information (even if they seem like fairytales to you) plus correcting several misconceptions regarding the qur'an.


Now stop trollin'

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Old 01-08-2011, 07:21   #312
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We have em Imams spam the media over here everytime something happens in Egypt, the hell you talking about.. -.-

Local media? That's okay I guess, but it's a global economy and their threat is global, not just local. You'd think something like that would make something a little more relative to the worldwide issue they are creating no?

Supporting terrorism is forbidden, not fighting it is even worse, if Imams don't do something about it, they don't deserve to be called "Imams"

I have no disagreements with this statement at all. You're right there.

http://facts-not-fear.blogspot.com/2...terrorism.html - Please, browse this page, and let's shut the whole "muslims do not oppose the terrorism" argument.

I'm talking about hardcore, major action opposition. These people are still recruiting from Mosques, still using Islam as their crutch for committing mass murder. Secular opposition isn't unified, and without unity, it will fail.

Us has screwed up more than anyone did, they butt-in whatever crap happens around the world, they make it worse instead of fixing it. Terrorists have nor will ever kill as much as the US did in the past 20-30 years.

Okay, we'll say, for the sake of argument, 30 years. That would put us all the way back to 1981. Let's see what wars we've been in since then, and why you assume the US is a mass-murdering machine. Aside from Vietnam, which officially ended in 1978, seems like the next "major" conflict was the 1991 FREEING of Kuwait from Iraq. In case you don't remember, Iraq invaded Kuwait, and the US was a major contributor to freeing that Muslim nation from Iraq's control. Honestly, what you're trying to compare there cannot be accurately compared. When the US goes to war, it's against other armies. When terrorists go to war, it's against innocent people. The US focuses on ending hostile combatants lives, not innocent lives. Terrorists focus on killing people that can't fight back, because they are limp-wristed cowards.

Terrorist militants haven't made it to the US yet, I don't kno wth you're talking about, defending yourselves? seriously? who would be stupid enough to do it anyway lol. Not that it won't happen in the future considering the US has been going down the drain lately. =/

Haven't made it to the US yet? WTF. 9/11? The idiotic underwear bomber? The kid in Washington trying to blow up a Christmas Day parade? ALL ISLAMIC TERRORISTS. Wow, I'm sorry, but that is the worst statement you've made yet.

I think most American soldiers enjoy what they do, from killing innocents to rape their mothers/sisters, think we all know what I'm talking about.

Where the hell do you get the idea soldiers enjoy killing, and rape? I will not rule out that there are bad apples in every bunch, even you should be able to admit that. But faulting and entire group of people based upon the actions of a few, is stupid. Not to mention, when these idiots revel in their disgusting actions, they are dealt with by military courts. You want rape? Look at what Arabic Muslims are doing to Black Muslims in Sudan. Then tell me about Americans.

A while ago, seen news and was shocked, some Israeli soldiers were breaching houses in palastine, they came to this one house and put a claymore or something to blow up when someone walks over it, so this woman opens the door and blows up infront of her kids, soliders kept laughing while childs were screaming. Guess who's still supporting them? the US is.

My statement above. Anyone who engages in those sort of acts should be dealt with most severely. Yet, the actions of those few are not the actions of an entire people. It's like the assumption you're combating here, that all Muslims are terrorists. Are you not doing the very same thing to the US, and Israel? You think we're all bad, but are so quick to point out others' faults, that you are blind to your own.

Supporting the actions pretty much equals committing them.
Refer to the verse and chapter number where it says "eagle will bring peace" I do not think qur'an ever mentioned "eagle" But I can't fully remember, so may you refer me to where you've seen the verse?

Oh heck, it's something I read a long time ago, in a book that was describing Islam, and breaking down the Quran for us non-Muslims.

I'm sure mohammed knew buttloads of things that we don't, Such as being attacked by the entire world, like we are now. ;p it's a sign actually, a sign to the judgment day, or what you guys call "apocalypse".

I think the reason you feel you are being attacked, is because of the militants, and the half-hearted efforts of conventional Muslims to combat the rising tide of terrorism. You apparently (as in Muslims) see everyone else as a threat, an invader, etc etc, but you won't deal decisively with the problems in your own back yard. Let me put it this way. If your dog (terrorists) keep jumping the fence and biting my kids (innocent people) I will kill it. Makes sense? Islamic terrorists are a product of Islam and a lax method of dealing with them.

I'm not exactly trying to drown myself into politics crap, I'm here to clear things out regarding my religion..you guys got anymore questions or?
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Old 01-08-2011, 09:53   #313
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Didn't know you hate yourself.


o you mean the 2 giant posts I wrote to arronax and he couldn't understand a word of them? it was regarding the qur'an so I didn't feel like loosen up.



pfft! again, I ws disproving several things he claimed to have happened in the past by using my own sources of information (even if they seem like fairytales to you) plus correcting several misconceptions regarding the qur'an.


Now stop trollin'
Your own sources of information aren't legit. Getting "facts" from religious sources is like saying you got a sloppy ass BJ from a ghost... where's the actual physical evidence that you didn't just fap?

They don't SEEM like fairy tales. They are fairy tales. Fairy tales are stories kids are told to give them high hopes, and possibly to teach a lesson... that's EXACTLY what religion does, only religion's aim is to teach them "lessons" that fill them with ideas that keep them god-fearing, so they will remain sheep.

Why are you replying to my statements with comments on what other people said? Usually people dodge when they want to avoid the situation/conflict.
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Old 01-09-2011, 08:37   #314
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Originally Posted by Neko.chan View Post
Local media? That's okay I guess, but it's a global economy and their threat is global, not just local. You'd think something like that would make something a little more relative to the worldwide issue they are creating no?

I'm talking about hardcore, major action opposition. These people are still recruiting from Mosques, still using Islam as their crutch for committing mass murder. Secular opposition isn't unified, and without unity, it will fail.

Last I checked the internet isn't a local media, you believe your own local media that degenerates the islam every hour. Stop giving me lame comments or excuses...

Nobody is being recruited from mosques, terrorists don't pick up people from mosques lol.



Okay, we'll say, for the sake of argument, 30 years. That would put us all the way back to 1981. Let's see what wars we've been in since then, and why you assume the US is a mass-murdering machine. Aside from Vietnam, which officially ended in 1978, seems like the next "major" conflict was the 1991 FREEING of Kuwait from Iraq. In case you don't remember, Iraq invaded Kuwait, and the US was a major contributor to freeing that Muslim nation from Iraq's control. Honestly, what you're trying to compare there cannot be accurately compared. When the US goes to war, it's against other armies. When terrorists go to war, it's against innocent people. The US focuses on ending hostile combatants lives, not innocent lives. Terrorists focus on killing people that can't fight back, because they are limp-wristed cowards.


30 years or 40 or 10, they have killed way more than terrorists will ever do. Live with that.

Most arabic countries including Egypt tried to put Iraq hands away from Kuwait, the lovely America didn't do something extraordinary. It's hilarious how you're making it sound like America's only duty is to stop civil wars or others wars between diff countries. They gave Iraq the necessary weapons to strike Iran, 2 decades later bush lied and fooled all of you into thinking that iraq had weapons of mass destruction such as the ones were used in Iraq-Iran war. Lmfao

Apparently, America had focused its eyes on Iraq since long time ago.

When america goes to war, they go against other armies and civilians, rape their mothers/sisters, kill their childs. And EVEN, let's just say, EVEN if they wrongly killed innocents now n then, they have still killed more innocents than the 5 innocents-per-bomb that a terrorist may murder. pfft



Haven't made it to the US yet? WTF. 9/11? The idiotic underwear bomber? The kid in Washington trying to blow up a Christmas Day parade? ALL ISLAMIC TERRORISTS. Wow, I'm sorry, but that is the worst statement you've made yet.

Well not that I believe 9/11 were done by anyone but americans themselves, but I may have confused terrorists with other countries, well you say america is defending itself against other countries, america hasn't been officially conquered by any countries, yet.

Iraq, didn't, vietnam or w/e didnt. the only war that I'd thank america for was the WWII for saving us from them nazis. That's all.



Where the hell do you get the idea soldiers enjoy killing, and rape? I will not rule out that there are bad apples in every bunch, even you should be able to admit that. But faulting and entire group of people based upon the actions of a few, is stupid. Not to mention, when these idiots revel in their disgusting actions, they are dealt with by military courts. You want rape? Look at what Arabic Muslims are doing to Black Muslims in Sudan. Then tell me about Americans.

Some do, some don't, the result is the same = they massacred innocents.

Abu-gharib prison in Iraq is a solid proof, those sick-minded sons of biitches. Or haven't you heard the 2 years old news yet?

Haha, love how you're asking me not to judge the entire group by the actions of the few, when you, yourself, judged my religion and marked it as an extreme religion full of terrorists because bin laden messed with your lovely twin towers. (if he really did it)

Cut the hypocrisy.


My statement above. Anyone who engages in those sort of acts should be dealt with most severely. Yet, the actions of those few are not the actions of an entire people. It's like the assumption you're combating here, that all Muslims are terrorists. Are you not doing the very same thing to the US, and Israel? You think we're all bad, but are so quick to point out others' faults, that you are blind to your own.

They were judged "locally" iraq civvies didn't have their own justice, you guys judged those sick minded dip****s for your rep around the world

See, I used your own logic and it seemed stupid at this time...



Oh heck, it's something I read a long time ago, in a book that was describing Islam, and breaking down the Quran for us non-Muslims.

Lame, you base your opinion about 1.4 billion muslims on some fairytale book made by some obsessive dip**** who reminds me of arronax?

Laame...Where's your mighty mind that you think by?


I think the reason you feel you are being attacked, is because of the militants, and the half-hearted efforts of conventional Muslims to combat the rising tide of terrorism. You apparently (as in Muslims) see everyone else as a threat, an invader, etc etc, but you won't deal decisively with the problems in your own back yard. Let me put it this way. If your dog (terrorists) keep jumping the fence and biting my kids (innocent people) I will kill it. Makes sense? Islamic terrorists are a product of Islam and a lax method of dealing with them.

Call it half-hearted, you just don't wanna acknowledge our efforts nor even acknowledge us, I'm ok with it.

People have been hating on us out of fear/jealousy, I don't know. But people really do have issues against us lol.

We deal with the problems in our own back yard, everytime we cease a bunch of terrorists, more appear...

But hey, the US has been in Afganistan for how many years? did they stop bin laden? half-hearted efforts made by the us right? Cut the crap, please...

Your terrorists are dog example made sense, I don't mind killing them or rather fighting them back, just don't blame us for attacking you.

Like you said, they jump the fence, you have no reason to blame the householders for it. As the householders already made a fence.
Hey, politics are crap, sad and boring. I lost interest in the thread when the subject became about politics.

Any religion questions or should I stop visiting your forums already? Answer this post or not, I won't answer back if it does not include religion matters.


@LP, you butted-in when I was slapping arronax around like a lost dog, so technically if you're gonna talk about my argument with him and how I "messed up", i'll be bringing him up in the discussion now n then.

You say religions are fairytales, your boyfriend is obsessive about these fairytales, so I smacked him down with the correct sources of them fairytales.

I'm fond of stupid trolls like you. <3

Last edited by Ahmed.k?; 01-09-2011 at 08:43.
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Old 01-09-2011, 10:23   #315
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Lol at you guys arguing over fairytales

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